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Author Topic: Fostereing: UPDATE on Cookie  (Read 8207 times)
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Shellie
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« on: September 14, 2014, 12:12:55 PM »

So I was at a dog rescue event yesterday hosted by my friend.  She had asked a bunch of us to come help out with meet and greet,  and walking the dogs.  I was more than happy to go help out.  We'll,  three of the dogs weren't adopted (out of 23, not too bad.)  one sadly had to go to a local shelter (thankfully no-kill)  because he didn't play well with others,  and all of us helping already have at least one dog.

So the other two were up for fostering.  One was way too hyper and strong for me,  I have autoimmune disorders that prevent me from being able to give him the exercise he needs.  The other was a jack russel/beagle mix.  She asked me to foster her,  and if possible,  keep her.

I'm not positive this is working out.  Sad  My munchkin want so Love on this dog so much,  but the dog is afraid of her shadow,.  She won't come upstairs,  and refuses to let munchkin near her.  She won't go to the bathroom outside,  and is a medium size dog,  which is creating some problems for me.

Cookie (the foster)  even tried to bite munchkin because I had gone to the bathroom and mistakenly left them where munchkin could get at her,  and tried to mount her!   Just don't know what to do.
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Alison
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« Reply #1 on: September 14, 2014, 03:45:10 PM »

Well done for trying to foster.It must be so hard with a puppy.I have no experiance of it,but Sandie and others here do so I'm sure they'll be along to advise you soon.Alison
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Freedom (Sandie)
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« Reply #2 on: September 14, 2014, 09:43:37 PM »

Fostering is hard work, and so very rewarding.

What do you know about Cookie's background?  That is important.  Was she a house pet?  Or a working dog?  Kept in a cage, or crate trained, or free run of the house, or a barn dog?
Also, How old is she?  Is she spayed?  Was that done recently?  Has she ever had puppies? 

A beagle mix is a completely different breed, they are scent hounds.  They follow their nose, and usually a beagle can never get to the point of being allowed off leash. 

It sounds like Cookie has been bounced around a lot recently -- she was some place, then at the adoption event, and now with you.  That is a great deal of change for a dog, in a short time. 

As a foster mom, you have to know the dog's background, and then you have to spend lots of time working with the dog.  First, you want the dog to bond with you.  Second, you want to work on identifying and correcting whatever bad habits the dog has.    This typically requires that you have some background in dog behavior and in dog training. 

Cookie may not come upstairs because she has never encountered stairs, and does not know how to manage them.  This is the sort of thing you learn from her background.

Jack russells tend to be VERY HYPER dogs, with a ton of energy.  They require a strong pack leader, and they need a job.  this breed usually does best when the owner takes the dog to training and then moves on to Agility, nose work (which would also tie in with the beagle), Tricks, or some other class.   JRTs and beagles are NOT companion breeds like bichons; they are very active dogs, and they need an owner to address that.

Honestly, I am rather shocked that a person involved in rescue 'dumped' a dog on you like this.  From what I recall, you have minimal background with dogs and would not be qualified for most foster programs.  Just my opinion. 
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Shellie
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« Reply #3 on: September 14, 2014, 11:06:20 PM »

No background at all. And the dog has no history. She was a "drop and run". Truthfully, I think she was abused at some point. She's not house trained. She won't even go to the bathroom when I take her outside. She'll go outside, sniff around for half an hour. By then I'm exhausted, and I bring her back in.

I don't know whether she can do stairs or not, but she won't even go to that side of the house. She is currently hiding in the downstairs fireplace Sad I can't get her out. I may call my friend tomorrow and see if she can come get cookie Sad
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Freedom (Sandie)
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« Reply #4 on: September 15, 2014, 11:04:14 AM »

She needs brisk walkies for peeing and pooping to happen.  Standing around in the back yard is not going to work.

I feel badly for her, and that she is going to be bounced around again.  However, I truly do not believe she is in a good fit with you and Munchkin.  Sure hope the person does some work finding the right foster home for Cookie this time around.  As I keep saying, continued bouncing from house to house is not good for a dog who is already this worked up.

« Last Edit: September 15, 2014, 06:08:06 PM by Freedom (Sandie) » Logged

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Shellie
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« Reply #5 on: September 15, 2014, 12:10:32 PM »

Well,  we decided she'll stay with us until they find her a forever home.  My kids came home last night and fell in love with her.  Ugh.  I did get her to pee outside this morning,  and she'll walk around downstairs and let the kids pet her.  But mostly she just wants to be left alone.  I think if it were just me and Cookie,  she would do fine upstairs.  But she's still afraid of munchkin.  Of course,  my kids want to keep her,  but I'm not positive that's the best thing.  Maybe in a day or two,  she'll warm up to him?
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Susan J
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« Reply #6 on: September 15, 2014, 12:48:59 PM »


Cookie (the foster)  even tried to bite munchkin because I had gone to the bathroom and mistakenly left them where munchkin could get at her,  and tried to mount her!   Just don't know what to do.

This would make me so afraid.   scared    Does Munchkin stay away from her now? 
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Shellie
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« Reply #7 on: September 15, 2014, 01:20:09 PM »

Munchkin can't do stairs, and cookie is too afraid to come up
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Shellie
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« Reply #8 on: September 15, 2014, 03:48:35 PM »

UPDATE: I got munchkin and cookie to play together for a bit today. I was making the mistake of trying to get cookie upstairs for them to play. Then it dawned on me, this is uncharted territory, and with a new dog. So i took munchkin downstairs and held him while cookie sniffed at him for a bit. finally, I let munchkin down, and the two of them did the running around and sniffing each other and all that for a while. then you could tell Cookie was done with all of this because she went to go lay down. Munchkin still wanted to play, and that's when i intervened and picked up Munchkin and brought him back upstairs. Now he's trying his darnedest to get me to bring him back downstairs!
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Freedom (Sandie)
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« Reply #9 on: September 15, 2014, 06:09:51 PM »

Ha haaa, Munchkin sees her as a play mate!

 You do need to spend one on one time with Cookie, use some treats and work with her on some commands.  Come, and sit, are usually the first ones.

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Shellie
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« Reply #10 on: September 15, 2014, 11:10:23 PM »

I'm going down every few hours to check on her, and if she'll let me, I pet her. I have been feeding her three times a day in smaller amounts because that's what the shelter did. Eventually, I'll up the amounts in the morning and at night, and slowly phase out the middle meal. In the meantime, every time I feed her, I put some in my hand and she'll sometimes eat out of my hand Smiley

I just hope I'm doing enough for her that she eventually wants to come upstairs. I have no history with dogs, and especially rescues, so I'm not overly confident. I'm just using my best judgement on how she must be feeling. I've decided that we're her permanent foster home until and if she gets a forever home. I don't want her bounced around any more than I'm sure she doesn't want to be bounced.

My main concern is I have no way of exercising her. I have chronic fatigue, which prevents me from running for any length of time. I mean, I can, but then I'll sleep the rest of the day, whether I want to or not! I don't have a fenced in yard for her to play in, so the most exercise she'll get is running around the house. Right now, it doesn't seem like she wants to, but then who knows if she were allowed to just go outside if she would want to?

Munchkin is just fine running around the house, little as he is. My house has two floors, and each floor is 1000 square feet, and munchkin loves to just run in circles around the "grand room" which is probably about 500 square feet. Seems to be enough exercise for him. I'm feeling that's not gonna be enough for Cookie.
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« Reply #11 on: September 16, 2014, 04:13:42 AM »

Personally, I think it's best to assume that Cookie's background has been one of neglect, whether from lack of training, socialisation or from abuse. This means that everything for Cookie is either new, or scarey, and needs to be approached with patience, kindness and love.
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« Reply #12 on: September 16, 2014, 04:17:50 AM »

Anyway, well done for fostering, it's not an easy thing to do. In regards to exercise, maybe some games could be introduced to help use up energy (both physical and emotional). Balls, tugging, maybe hiding treats and getting the dogs to look for them. Would be good for Mucnhkin too
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Shellie
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« Reply #13 on: September 16, 2014, 11:47:43 AM »

I need to rename this thread to be called the Cookie Update thread! LOL Thank you all for sticking with me through my non-bichon escapades. I have come to trust you all, and I wouldn't want to be asking advice from strangers or keeping them updated on my new lovey.

So anyway, now for the update. I had the harebrained idea last night to bring Cookie up at 10 p.m. Not harebrained in that it didn't go well, it did. Harebrained in the way that my kids were sleeping when I did it! I had been playing with her downstairs, and she showed interest in coming upstairs with me. Seems that she actually CANT do stairs, not that she wont. So she put her first paws up on the stairs and then started looking around like "how does this happen?"

So I picked her up and brought her upstairs, big dog that she is! I can't do that too often, it'll set me to bed! Anyway, I held Munchkin so that she could sniff him without him jumping all over her like puppies do. When she was done, I put Munchkin down, and she went under a kitchen chair. He sniffed her, and then she came out for a bit until Munchkin barked, then she went back under.

This is when my daughter came out. She was like, "What is munchkin upset over?" I said it's because Cookie won't play with him. She was so happy to see cookie upstairs! So cookie came over for "pets" and munchkin started barking again, which sent cookie under the table. She wasn't shaking, just I guess protecting herself. If she had been shaking, I would have brought her back downstairs.

Anyway, this went on for about a half an hour, coming out, munchkin barking, going back under. Finally, she came out and let munchkin jump on her a bit. Finally, she had enough and growled. I picked munchkin up, and she started wandering around the upstairs, sniffing everything. When she was done, she came back over. I let munchkin down, and they both sniffed around together for a while.

Then - they PLAYED! Both of them grabbed the same toy and started chewing on it. Then one would let go, then the other, and they would both pick it up again. So cute. After that, I brought munchkin to bed. Cookie didn't want to come to bed with me, choosing a towel in the living room instead.  This morning they're playing together nicely. I'm so happy, I can't even express.

Thank you to whomever posted those videos in this section of the forum. They gave me the wherewithall to keep at this. Cookie just needed to see that I was there for her, sitting on the floor the whole time, not backing away or leaving when she went back under the table, petting her whenever she came over to me, and holding munchkin when she was scared. Smiley
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Freedom (Sandie)
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« Reply #14 on: September 16, 2014, 04:47:37 PM »

Great update, wonderful progress!

I agree with Claire, sounds like Cookie has had a rough start in life.  Patience and small steps will help her come out of her shell.

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Alison
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« Reply #15 on: September 16, 2014, 06:09:48 PM »

Sounds like wonderful progress well done
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Shellie
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« Reply #16 on: September 17, 2014, 11:58:25 PM »

Thanks for the continuing support, guys.

For those of you with more than one doggie, when you integrated a second dog, did the first get listless in any way? It seems to me that Munchkin is "down." He's not as playful, and doesn't follow me around all day like he used to. He still follows me for a great part of the day, but sometimes, he just looks up, whines, and lays back down. Sometimes when I'm holding him, he whines, too. Not that he wants to get down, but almost like a "this isn't the way I wanted it" lind of thing. Maybe I'm reading too much into it?

The dogs seem to be fighting for alpha, also. Munchkin has tried to mount Cookie on several occasions. Cookie is three times the size of Munchkin, and very quickly "pins" him down. She has even gone for the throat (gently) a few times when Munchkin persists. It never ends with someone getting hurt, but I have a feeling that Cookie will be the dominant dog when all this stops. My kids got upset because the dogs were fighting at one point, and Cookie was bearing her teeth, and then Munchkin did so in kind as well. It was a little scary to see, but I supervised the whole thing, ready to "rescue" Munchkin at a moment's notice.

Any advice welcome here. (Even if it's just that this is normal behavior, and to back off LOL)  Thanks Smiley
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Susan J
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« Reply #17 on: September 18, 2014, 09:33:41 AM »


Then - they PLAYED! Both of them grabbed the same toy and started chewing on it. Then one would let go, then the other, and they would both pick it up again. So cute. After that, I brought munchkin to bed. Cookie didn't want to come to bed with me, choosing a towel in the living room instead.  This morning they're playing together nicely. I'm so happy, I can't even express.



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Shellie
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« Reply #18 on: September 23, 2014, 11:15:13 AM »

Well, it looks like Cookie has to go Sad  As she gets more comfortable here, I can see that her old parents didn't train her at all. She poops and pees everywhere, which is the least of the troubles. She destroys EVERYTHING (including my dining room table), but even that I could probably work with. She tries to hurt munchkin to the point where I won't leave the house without taking Munchkin with me. That's hard, but....
Yesterday, she scratched my back trying to get me out of bed. I have chronic fatigue, and I can't get out of bed all at once. It takes time. Munchkin has learned to deal with this, and though he whines, he just patiently waits for me to get out of bed, and then moseys along with me to the kitchen for let-outs and breakfast. Cookie, not so much. She climbed on top of me and started digging at my back. I mean as if she was outside in the dirt. Hurt so bad. When I finally got up, she started doing it to my leg. I finally got to the door, let her out, and closed it. I didn't want to let her back in, but I eventually did.
I spent almost the entire day trying to keep her teeth off of one thing or another. Toys, shoes, tables, chairs, munchkin, my arm... it just gets worse every day. I have the lady who runs the rescue coming tonight or tomorrow morning to get her and re-home her. I said NO other pets and NO children. Can you imagine if she had gotten her claws into my kids?!
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« Reply #19 on: September 23, 2014, 12:13:19 PM »

You tried. That is more than a lot would do.  You certainly can't put Munchkin in danger and it would take a lot to retrain her plus wondering whether or not she could ever be completely trusted.  It's sad but it is the situation with so many furpups who have originally been adopted by irresponsible humans and then abandoned when they become too unruly.   sad
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Alison
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« Reply #20 on: September 25, 2014, 01:20:27 PM »

I'm sorry to hear that.Recognising your limitations is an important thing to be able to do for you and the dog so I'm glad you've made a quick decision.I hope she gets a home where they can train her very soon and you can get back to feeling more comfortable and enjoying Munchkin again.

Alison
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Shellie
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« Reply #21 on: September 25, 2014, 01:23:51 PM »

Me, too! I cried when I dropped her off, but they said she will be immediately available for adoption because she has no prior issues and she already saw the vet, so I'm hopeful she'll be rehomed within a week. Things around here are already back to normal, which is a relief because I suffer from anxiety to begin with and I could feel myself heading down that dark tunnel. I feel bad for the dog, but I have to remember I never planned on keeping her, and since the original agency wasn't going to re-home her, I had to take things into my own hands for my own health.

Thank you all for your kind words and encouragement.
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